Talk:Tosks

PHYSICAL ANTHROPOLOGY OF TOSKS

According to the anthropologist Carleton Coon, Tosks are not dark Mediterranean types but rather of stocky build, mainly Alpine in type. They are of medium colouring like the Southern and Central French. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.154.100.144 (talk) 06:44, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

Infobox

I have removed the infobox of both Tosks and Ghegs. The infobox are for ethnic groups, not for speakers of dialects. The more important problem with the use of infoboxes is that despite the common misconception which exists among some western authors, gegë are just the speakers of "northern" dialects who lived just north of the Shkumbin river in Mat District. People from Malësia or Dukagjin don't call themselves gegë and don't call their dialects gegnisht. Toskë is a term used by those speakers of "southern" dialects who lived south of the Shkumbin river in central/eastern and south-eastern Albania. People of Labëria or natives of Myzeqe don't call themselves toskë and don't speak toskërisht.--Maleschreiber (talk) 00:40, 31 March 2022 (UTC)

You are right. The infobox should not be added. – Βατο (talk) 10:31, 18 February 2025 (UTC)

Dear Maleschreiber,

I understand your concerns regarding the use of infoboxes for Ghegs and Tosks, but I believe that removing the infobox for Ghegs is not justified. The Ghegs are not merely speakers of a northern dialect but represent a distinct ethno-cultural group within the Albanian people. Here are a few key reasons why an infobox as an ethnic group is appropriate:

1. Ethnic Identity and Self-Perception

While it is true that some Ghegs identify more strongly with their regional tribal affiliations (e.g., Malësorë, Dukagjinas), the term Gheg has historically been used to describe a broader ethno-cultural group. This identity is recognized not only by external scholars but also in historical and sociological contexts.

2. Distinct Cultural and Social Characteristics

Ghegs have traditionally maintained distinct social structures, including the well-documented tribal system in northern Albania, Montenegro, and Kosovo. Their historical adherence to the Kanun of Lekë Dukagjini, their specific customs, and their clan-based society further differentiate them from Tosks. This level of cultural distinction goes beyond mere linguistic variation.

3. Recognition in Academic and Historical Literature

Many historical and anthropological sources classify Ghegs as a distinct subgroup of Albanians, not merely as a linguistic category. Removing the infobox would disregard centuries of historical and ethnographic research that acknowledges their unique cultural and social structures.

4. Precedent in Other Ethnic Groups

Other ethno-linguistic groups, such as the Scots and Bavarians, are often recognized with infoboxes despite the fluidity of linguistic and regional identities. The same standard should apply to Ghegs, who have a well-documented ethno-cultural distinction.

For these reasons, I believe that retaining the infobox for Ghegs is not only justified but necessary for accurately representing their historical and cultural significance.

Best regards,

Azphalt Azphalt (talk) 11:05, 21 February 2025 (UTC)

Scots are an ethnic group which identifies as such. They're not just speakers of a dialect. Speakers of southern Albanian dialects don't identify themselves as "Tosks". It's arbitrary to add infoboxes which can't be supported by bibliography.--Maleschreiber (talk) 23:25, 4 March 2025 (UTC)