Talk:Gaza genocide/Archive 41

Archive 35

←

Archive 39

Archive 40

Archive 41

Archive 42

Archive 43

→

Archive 45

lede image in photomontage

proposal to change lede or first image in photomontage to File:Damage in Gaza Strip during the October 2023 - 36.jpg Cinaroot  💬 07:49, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

Why is this single picture a better image of the topic than the photomontage? Sorry I see the question was about rearranging the photomontage. Why is still a valid question though. NadVolum (talk) 16:07, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

photomontage - but change lede image of photomontage Cinaroot  💬 16:10, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

WP:JUSTDOIT SuperPianoMan9167 (talk) 17:06, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

I need consensus - because this was a previous 1RR violation. ty Cinaroot  💬 17:12, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

Getting consensus is a fair request if this is in response to the requirement that "Changes challenged by reversion may not be reinstated without affirmative consensus on the talk page". Which editor reverted the prior change? Perhaps tag them so that they can explain the objection. Coining (talk) 17:59, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

It was @IOHANNVSVERVS who appears to have first reverted the change. SuperPianoMan9167 (talk) 18:21, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

In my opinion it's optimal the way it is currently. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 18:34, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

I agree. The single image is not representative of the Genocide and the scale of the destruction. M.Bitton (talk) 22:24, 11 January 2026 (UTC) I misread the proposal. M.Bitton (talk) 16:11, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

This is not a proposal to remove multiple images or photomontage. The main image should be the one that represents human sufferings - not destroyed buildings. It just a proposal to rearrange photos in photomontage Cinaroot  💬 22:51, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

The current top image is rectangular so it fits well with the layout. I also think it is representative of the Gaza genocide overall, showing how widespread the destruction is. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 23:05, 11 January 2026 (UTC)

Could be unrelated but WP:SHOCK should probably be taken into consideration here; the suggested image is similar to images later in the article that show more of the depth of the destruction and probably shouldn't be in the lede. VidanaliK (talk to me) 00:54, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

genocide is about destruction of people. Everything else is secondary. The lede image in photomontage needs to be changed. I don't consider my proposed image as shocking. But you are welcome to propose an alternative. Cinaroot  💬 00:59, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

on second thought.. maybe it is shocking for some people. because iv looked at so many pics like these - iv gone numb. Im sorry. Cinaroot  💬 01:01, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

It's fine, after all the whole point of the Wikipedia process and seeking consensus is so that others can point out things you might not have thought of. VidanaliK (talk to me) 01:43, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

My bad (I misread it). M.Bitton (talk) 16:10, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

So u r okay to change the lede image of the photomontage? Cinaroot  💬 01:09, 13 January 2026 (UTC)

Are you proposing to keep the current lede image as part of the photomontage? If so, that seems like a reasonable change. Genocide is first and foremost a crime against people so there should probably be a person in the most prominent image. Not strongly wedded to that particular image though. CamAnders (talk) 09:07, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

Change to be first image. Genocides are against people, not buildings and civil infrastructure. The Holocaust uses a photo of Jewish people who were victims. We should follow their lead. Alexandraaaacs1989 (talk) 18:49, 12 January 2026 (UTC)

I feel pretty strongly about keeping it the way it is but since it's only a matter of opinion I won't object to Cinaroot's proposed change. And thank you Cinaroot for doing this as a discussion rather than just making the edit. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 01:15, 13 January 2026 (UTC)

It could be helpful if the different image suggestions are posted in this thread as pictures, for visibility. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:01, 13 January 2026 (UTC)

I agree with IOHANNVSVERVS. The image File:Images of war 23-25 from Gaza, by Jaber Badwen, IMG 6185.jpg is better than File:Damage in Gaza Strip during the October 2023 - 36.jpg in its illustration of the vast destruction as well as the urbicidal, domicidal, ecodical, etc. aspects of the genocide. The issue with File:Damage in Gaza Strip during the October 2023 - 36.jpg too is that it was taken October 2023 when there were still some healthcare facilities functioning, which was not the case for substantial periods of the genocide. إيان (talk) 20:59, 16 January 2026 (UTC)

If you can find an alternative with human element + destruction - we can find a compromise. I’m not convinced by your argument that the picture taken in Oct 2023 does not constitute genocide. functioning healthcare facilities does not determine genocide. Ty Cinaroot  💬 00:39, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

Something like this eh? https://www.amnesty.org/en/wp-content/uploads/2024/12/GettyImages-2182380031-scaled-e1733253256526-1468x710.jpg - IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 00:49, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

Something like that. But thats not on wikipedia. but some alternative choices would be nice.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Photographs_produced_by_UNRWA

Above is the photos we have from UNRWA Cinaroot  💬 00:58, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

I think the issue with your image Cinaroot is that it is too generic. It's just wounded people recieving treatment in a hospital, and it could have been from many conflicts or wars etc. While the previous main image is more distinctly exemplary of the Gaza genocide. In my opinion anyway. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 00:51, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

I didn’t select that pic. It was the picture used from the early days, and I thought it is less contentious. Cinaroot  💬 01:00, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

Cinaroot, that’s not at all my argument. I just meant that it isn’t representative of the situation for most of the genocide, after healthcare facilities, ambulances, aid vehicles, etc. had been systematically destroyed. There are also illustrative images we can consider for inclusion used on the Arabic version of the article, such as File:Al-Tabieen school massacre 05.jpg taken by Hossam Shabat or File:Palestine ambulance strike.png or File:A newborn baby was killed as a result of the Israeli airstrike of Nuseirat camp, Gaza Strip.jpg إيان (talk) 01:31, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

Are you proposing above images for lede ? If yes - i object

File:Al-Tabieen school massacre 05.jpg - i cannot understand what it is by looking at picture

File:Palestine ambulance strike.png - poor quality

File:A newborn baby was killed as a result of the Israeli airstrike of Nuseirat camp, Gaza Strip.jpg - Too shocking for infobox MOS:SHOCK Cinaroot  💬 01:39, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

I still prefer the stable File:Images of war 23-25 from Gaza, by Jaber Badwen, IMG 6185.jpg for the first image. I think File:Al-Tabieen school massacre 05.jpg could be added to the montage but not the first image. I think the others could be included elsewhere in the article. إيان (talk) 02:46, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

Agree with preferring the previous status quo. The other photo you propose though is too shocking and unillustrative (unclear what it depicts). IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 02:50, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

In the spirit of contributing to the discussion, and while I don't feel strongly about any of the photos, File:Evacuation of Palestinian patients from Al-Aqsa Martyrs Hospital in Deir al-Balah after Israeli army orders to evacuate eastern Deir el-Balah, Gaza Strip 5.jpg could be a contender--an immiserated hospital, the effect of so-called "evacuation orders", human consequences. My only reservation is that an individual's face is clearly pictured. WillowCity^(talk) 02:34, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

i think we can put this to a vote - after hearing everyone's proposal. i also have concerns about lighting in the image. its bit dark Cinaroot  💬 02:41, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

I do think the images of destruction are among the most notable aspects of the genocide. There doesn't seem to be a consistent rule about images for this type of article: the Holocaust has people, Rwandan Genocide and Cambodian Genocide have human skulls, Darfur genocide (2003-2005) has a map, and Rohingya Genocide has destruction of a village. (Man, that was a bleak exercise). So I think this is an area where discretion and consensus, rather than any rule or policy, will be decisive. As I said, I don't feel strongly, and I see arguments both ways. WillowCity^(talk) 03:06, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

I do not think we need to compare with the Rwandan Genocide and Cambodian Genocide - it’s likely because they do not have a rich set of available photos to choose from. But we do have it in the Gaza genocide.

I wish to show human impact over destruction or human + destruction

But I can back down - if people are objecting to it. Cinaroot  💬 05:10, 17 January 2026 (UTC)

The search can continue—as you’ve noted there’s an abundance of images to choose from—but let’s stick with the stable image as the main image for now. إيان (talk) 05:23, 18 January 2026 (UTC)

what about this? i took it from another wikipedia article

🐈 Cinaroot  💬 06:07, 18 January 2026 (UTC)