Talk:Chitpavan Brahmins

Request for Revision of "Messengers and Spies" Statement for Chitpavan Brahmins

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I would like to request a revision of the statement: "Initially working as messengers and spies in the late seventeenth century..." regarding the Chitpavan Brahmins.

Lack of Historical Evidence

There is no well-documented historical evidence suggesting that Chitpavan Brahmins worked as messengers or spies in the 17th century. Historical sources primarily indicate their roles in clerical and religious activities. The statement should be either supported by specific references or revised to accurately reflect their documented roles.

Prominent Administrative Roles

The Chitpavan Brahmins were known for their administrative, clerical, and religious responsibilities, particularly under the Peshwas. This highlights their roles as trusted intellectuals rather than as military or espionage figures.

Historical Context

The "late 17th century" refers to the period from approximately 1670 to 1700. During this period, figures such as Bahirji Naik were significant in the Maratha intelligence network, but there is no evidence linking Chitpavan Brahmins to espionage roles.

If Chitpavan Brahmins were involved in espionage, their names should be documented in historical records. The lack of such documentation suggests that the claim may be exaggerated or incorrect.

I believe this statement may violate Wikipedia’s guidelines for reliable sourcing and neutrality. I kindly request that it be revised to reflect the accurate historical roles of the Chitpavan community or supported with credible sources.

Thank you for your attention to this matter.

Koknastha2022 (talk) 03:04, 16 September 2024 (UTC) Koknastha2022

Concern Regarding the "Messengers and Spies" Assertion for second time in the document

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Dear Wikipedia Editors, I am writing to request a review and revision of the description of Chitpavan Brahmins in the article on Wikipedia, specifically regarding the claims that they were employed as messengers and spies in ancient times.

The mention of Chitpavan Brahmin as messangers and spies opens the description for the community. This is the second line on the page after the location. Also there is additional mention at the eand of the section. If this is so strongly supported I would like some strong reference to support this statement.

The current description states: "In ancient times, the Chitpavans were employed as messengers and spies. Later, with the rise of the Chitpavan Peshwa in the 18th century, they began migrating to Pune and found employment as military men, diplomats, and clerks in the Peshwa administration. A 1763–64 document shows that at least 67% of the clerks at the time were Chitpavans."

I believe this statement may be misleading and potentially derogatory. Based on historical records and available documentation, there is no substantial evidence or well-documented records to support the claim that Chitpavan Brahmins were primarily employed as messengers and spies during the late 17th century. Had that been the case we would have seen lot many Chitpavans working under Baharji Naik who worked as a spy and was integral to the success of Shivaji Maharaj’s military campaigns and the broader strategy of the Maratha Empire.

At the end of the 17th century, Chitpavan Brahmins were predominantly engaged in clerical and religious roles. They were involved in various administrative and scholarly activities, and their contributions were more aligned with intellectual and clerical pursuits rather than covert or espionage-related tasks. The assertion that they served as messengers and spies lacks historical evidence and is not corroborated by reliable sources.

To ensure the accuracy and reliability of the information presented on Wikipedia, I kindly request the following: Verification of Sources: Please provide any citations or historical sources that support the claim of Chitpavan Brahmins working as messengers and spies. If such sources are unavailable or cannot be substantiated, this statement should be immediately reconsidered. Revision of Content: If no credible sources can support the claim, I request that the statement be revised or removed to prevent the dissemination of potentially incorrect and harmful historical information.

A better description of the era could be as below -

• Religious and Clerical Roles: Before becoming prominent in political leadership, many Chitpavan Brahmins were engaged in religious rituals and clerical tasks. Their expertise in administration and religious scholarship set the foundation for their eventual rise in governance, but they were not yet significant political players in the Maratha Empire during the late 17th century.
• Balaji Vishwanath Bhat (1670–1720): Balaji Vishwanath is the most significant Chitpavan Brahmin to emerge during this time. He was appointed Peshwa in 1713, marking the beginning of the Chitpavans' rise to power in the Maratha Empire. His diplomatic skills helped consolidate Shahu Maharaj’s reign and stabilize Maratha finances and political power. This was the point at which Chitpavans moved into influential positions within the Maratha Empire.
• Later Roles as Peshwas: After Balaji Vishwanath, the Peshwa title became hereditary within his family, cementing Chitpavan Brahmins' control over the Maratha Empire. His son, Baji Rao I (1700–1740), further expanded the Maratha territories and led several successful military campaigns. By the mid-18th century, Chitpavans were firmly entrenched in political and administrative roles, shaping the empire's policies and military strategies.
• Positions in the Maratha Bureaucracy: Following the appointment of the first Peshwa, Chitpavan Brahmins began to occupy key bureaucratic and administrative roles within the Maratha Empire. These positions included not only governance but also roles in financial administration, judicial affairs, and foreign diplomacy. They were known for their administrative acumen, which helped streamline the Maratha Empire’s governance.

Thank you for your attention to this matter. I look forward to your response and the necessary corrections to ensure the historical accuracy of the article.

Sincerely, Koknastha2022 Koknastha2022 (talk) 03:59, 16 September 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 May 2025

Matthew110404 (talk) 05:21, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

Under populated places can you please put only Maharashtra and get rid of coastal

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Day Creature (talk) 07:06, 14 May 2025 (UTC)