Talk:Valeriano Orobón Fernández
Latest comment: 1 year ago by Grnrchst in topic Beware citogenesis
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Beware citogenesis
editThis source appears to crib directly from the old copy used in our article. It should not be cited as reliable fact. czar 07:43, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- @Czar: Just expanded this from stub and I think it might be worth digging into further. I found a source that cites Martin Baxmeyer's work on the subject, which I may have to read to see if it goes into further detail about Orobón's authorship. I'll admit I'm a bit concerned that Wikipedia may have generated another fake factoid, as the one source cited by the original Spanish Wikipedia article does not mention him authoring the song (see old version). A Google Scholar search of works written before the Wikipedia article was created bring up only two results: one is 2012 sheet music mistakenly tagged by Google as published in 2005; the other is a book about Spaniards in concentration camps from 2003. Thankfully, I'm able to find both of these books at a local library, so i may have to read in further.
- I'm going to be so upset if I have to write another damned article about this. --Grnrchst (talk) 17:06, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
- I've asked the author of the original Spanish Wikipedia article about this, hopefully they can shed some light on it. --Grnrchst (talk) 17:39, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
- It seems this detail first made its way into Wikipedia back in December 2004, when an anonymous IP added it to the Spanish Wikipedia article on A Las Barricadas (diff). It cites a long-dead website, which seemingly published this in March 2003. The website then cites the book Colección de canciones de lucha by Carlos Palacio, so that's another book I need to check out. At least we now know this fact is not a Wikipedia invention, even if it may have been propagated by Wikipedia. I just need to find any evidence at all that this information has a basis in the source material. --Grnrchst (talk) 18:33, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
- Me cago en la hostia, I actually found a proper early source. José de la Riva, writing in the Mundo Gráfico issue from 15 December 1937, says Orobón Fernández adapted the lyrics! Hooray! No citogenesis today! --Grnrchst (talk) 18:43, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
- Jacinto Toryho also appears to confirm it in his memoirs, so I think it's safe to close this. --Grnrchst (talk) 19:51, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
- Me cago en la hostia, I actually found a proper early source. José de la Riva, writing in the Mundo Gráfico issue from 15 December 1937, says Orobón Fernández adapted the lyrics! Hooray! No citogenesis today! --Grnrchst (talk) 18:43, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
- It seems this detail first made its way into Wikipedia back in December 2004, when an anonymous IP added it to the Spanish Wikipedia article on A Las Barricadas (diff). It cites a long-dead website, which seemingly published this in March 2003. The website then cites the book Colección de canciones de lucha by Carlos Palacio, so that's another book I need to check out. At least we now know this fact is not a Wikipedia invention, even if it may have been propagated by Wikipedia. I just need to find any evidence at all that this information has a basis in the source material. --Grnrchst (talk) 18:33, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
- I've asked the author of the original Spanish Wikipedia article about this, hopefully they can shed some light on it. --Grnrchst (talk) 17:39, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
In the meantime, should I leave in the detail about this? The source I've cited is more or less reliable, and at the very least isn't citing Wikipedia, but I'm very anxious about leaving up a possible citogenesis.--Grnrchst (talk) 17:06, 10 April 2025 (UTC)