Wikipedia talk:Featured articles/Archive 19
Latest comment: 3 months ago by HumanxAnthro in topic Grammar
 | This is an archive of past discussions about Wikipedia:Featured articles. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
| Archive 15 | ← | Archive 17 | Archive 18 | Archive 19 |
Grammar
I don't want to discuss about this but @SchroCat here claims that the comma in this sentence is redundant. He says that it's redundant because it's in British English but even if, to me, the comma is still needed there for grammar purpose. Can someone determine if a comma is needed there or no, because SchroCat is refusing to revert back. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 20:05, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- You need to take on board that there are different rules for commas in different varieties of English, as well as within varieties of English. I'm sorry that this seems to be something you're struggling to take on board. - SchroCat (talk) 20:08, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- Yet you haven't presented that "rule". You're just stating that it's redundant and saying that I'm struggling. Come up with a better reasoning. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 20:14, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- I'm British (living in the US); I haven't looked for a rule to cite, but I can assure you that not having a comma there is perfectly acceptable in British English. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 20:17, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- I'll step down and apologise once that "rule" has been cited. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 20:23, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- I think you'll be disappointed -- the "rules" for commas are notoriously anarchic. There's an excellent chapter called "That'll Do, Comma" in Lynn Truss's Eats, Shoots & Leaves that discusses the history and usage of the comma. A quote: "Aren't there rules for the comma, just as there are rules for the apostrophe? Well, yes; but you will be entertained to discover there is a significant complication in the case of the comma." Reading what follows makes it hard to argue for absolute rules in marginal cases. There are certainly occasions where everyone agrees a comma must (or must not) be used, but there's a grey area, and the comma being discussed here is in it. More quotes from Truss: "No wonder feelings run high about the comma. When it comes to improving the clarity of a sentence, you can nearly always argue that one should go in; you can nearly always argue that one should come out." She quotes Ernest Gowers: "The use of commas cannot be learned by rule", which perhaps would settle things if you agreed with Gowers, but she does go on to give some rules. In this case, though, I think you're going to have to rely on the opinion of native British English speakers who as far as you can tell are not illiterate to tell you what is normal in our version of English. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 20:43, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- Thank you @Mike Christie for explaining it to me. I'm just sorry for causing this conflict and trouble. I've lived in countries which were former British colonies so I do have advanced experience with British English. But because of the amount of time living in the United States, I think it's changing. Once again, I'm sorry for causing this trouble over a measly comma. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 20:49, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- English and its random rules, amirite? HUMANXANTHRO (What you say about his company is what you say about society) 20:18, 22 February 2026 (UTC)
- No worries. I do recommend reading Truss's book if you can get hold of it; aside from anything else, it's hilarious. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 20:50, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- I'll definitely try to get a hold of it for sure. Thank you for recommending it. Sorry everyone for my actions. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 20:56, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- No worries. I do recommend reading Truss's book if you can get hold of it; aside from anything else, it's hilarious. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 20:50, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- I think you'll be disappointed -- the "rules" for commas are notoriously anarchic. There's an excellent chapter called "That'll Do, Comma" in Lynn Truss's Eats, Shoots & Leaves that discusses the history and usage of the comma. A quote: "Aren't there rules for the comma, just as there are rules for the apostrophe? Well, yes; but you will be entertained to discover there is a significant complication in the case of the comma." Reading what follows makes it hard to argue for absolute rules in marginal cases. There are certainly occasions where everyone agrees a comma must (or must not) be used, but there's a grey area, and the comma being discussed here is in it. More quotes from Truss: "No wonder feelings run high about the comma. When it comes to improving the clarity of a sentence, you can nearly always argue that one should go in; you can nearly always argue that one should come out." She quotes Ernest Gowers: "The use of commas cannot be learned by rule", which perhaps would settle things if you agreed with Gowers, but she does go on to give some rules. In this case, though, I think you're going to have to rely on the opinion of native British English speakers who as far as you can tell are not illiterate to tell you what is normal in our version of English. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 20:43, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- I'll step down and apologise once that "rule" has been cited. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 20:23, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- I'm British (living in the US); I haven't looked for a rule to cite, but I can assure you that not having a comma there is perfectly acceptable in British English. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 20:17, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- @Ivebeenhacked: Orthographical idiosyncratic inflexions such as
I don't want to discuss about this
andbut even if, to me, the comma is still needed there for grammar purpose
do not instil confidence in your ability to discern between varieties of English and/or comma-commonality dissonance therein. I hope this helps. Happy editing. —Fortuna, imperatrix 21:26, 13 December 2025 (UTC)- @Fortuna imperatrix mundi: Yes, it helps. If you don't trust in my comma usage, that's fine. Thank you for being honest with me. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 21:34, 13 December 2025 (UTC)
- Yet you haven't presented that "rule". You're just stating that it's redundant and saying that I'm struggling. Come up with a better reasoning. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 20:14, 13 December 2025 (UTC)