Talk:Peter Warlock

Brian Sewell

Is there any actual evidence except Sewell's own claim that he was Warlock's son? Unless there is, shouldn't the claim be treated sceptically? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.205.194.187 (talk) 21:32, 15 October 2016 (UTC)

In popular culture

Nikkimaria Significance? A film was made of his life. That is more than significant; it's notable. There are literally hundreds of articles on subjects that list films (or portrayals in media) in a Popular Culture Section : Parker , Warhol , Liberace , Lewis , Hepburn , etc, etc, etc. This is standard practice at WP. What isn't standard practice is blindly reverting a source content with an edit summary not backed by WP policy: "significance?". Bring it to the Talk Page if you have a question; not the edit summary. It is a significant inclusion as supported by a previous editor's inclusion under External links: Voices at IMDb. I am reinstating. Do not revert unless you gain consensus here. Maineartists (talk) 04:21, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

It is usually unwise to add a whole section to a Featured Article without first securing consensus to do so on the article talk page. I'd support deleting the addition. This 1969 film was known about when the article was promoted to FA but no reviewer thought it worthwhile mentioning. The film itself has no Wikipedia article - a distinction achieved mainly by films of the utmost unimportance. It was never shown in the cinema, according to the cited sources, but only on American television, and the cited source mentions its "ludicrous misrepresentations" and dismisses it as a laughable travesty. The answer to Nikkimaria's question "Significance?" is plainly "zero", in my view. I do not think we would be doing our readers any favours by mentioning this film. Tim riley talk 07:30, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

Tim riley I couldn't disagree with you more on all grounds. Simply because the film has no WP article, does not disqualify its significance or reason for inclusion. WP works on sources, not wikilinks. Furthermore, your defense to delete is strictly personal based on what you deem to be "quality". What you are actually describing is what would make up a reception section - very common. WP does not base inclusion on praise by critics only. Lastly WP does not work on personal preference or "thinking" as to what a reader would like or not like. WP is not in the business of selling newspapers with content that appeals to customers' likes and dislikes. The examples given, which are endlessly found across WP, are not included based on personal preference, quality, critical praise, etc; but because this is an encyclopedia and they are fact. Plain and simple. But in keeping with your view of how content should be added: the above editor removed the link to "Find a Grave" under External Links; something that is commonly found across the board in WP articles for BPs. No reason. Just removal. However, there is an image under Death that shows an unmarked grave plot: "Foreground. The unmarked grave plot, Nightingale cemetery Godalming". If we are to use your method for inclusion, and the editor's reasoning for removal, this is also: "zero". To include: "Philip Heseltine was buried alongside his father at Godalming cemetery on 20 December 1930" and find it "significant" and not a film made about his life, is to compare apples to apples. In keeping, what is the "significance" for including Warlock's own epitaph: " Here lies Warlock the composer. Who lived next door to Munn the grocer. He died of drink and copulation, A sad discredit to the nation"? One might say this is mere "filler" and certainly "trivial". No "significance". But that's not how an encyclopedia works. If you do not think the film mentioned merits its own section, then place it somewhere else within the article: legacy. In my estimation, this entire article is undue weight focused on praise only for a composer hardly anyone knows or plays anymore. But that is no reason to not have an article on him. Maineartists (talk) 12:08, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is a poor argument for inclusion, and the burden of consensus is on those seeking to include. As for the external link you question, see WP:ELPEREN. Nikkimaria (talk) 12:12, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

And saying "OTHERSTUFFEXITSTS is a poor argument for inclusion" is an overused dismissal. Thanks for the WP:ELPEREN. You've got a lot of cleaning up to do at WP then. Good luck. Maineartists (talk) 12:19, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

The main author of this article, the late Brian Boulton, had more than 100 featured articles to his credit, Nikkimaria has been a key contributor to countless FAC reviews and I have taken more than 40 articles to FAC. We are not unacquainted with or clueless about quality articles. You are of course entitled to contrary views, but I don't think it is necessary to lecture us at length, as you do above. I suggest we leave the thread open for a few days lest a consensus build up to keep the new section, failing which it can safely be deleted, I'd say. Tim riley talk 14:09, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

Regardless of whether or not a "popular culture" section is appropriate, it is certainly not appropriate to create a brand new section for a single item, particularly on a heavily vetted FA. Notice my emphasis of "single"; the item would be more fitting in the "legacy" section, if anywhere. However, since the film itself does not have a WP article, I find myself leaning towards total exclusion. Aza24 (talk) 05:54, 31 October 2021 (UTC)

Grave photos

Gor1995 since the discussion on my talk page I have now been to Nightingale Cemetery and taken a series of photos of the surroundings of the grave and detailed ones of it. I hope to upload them to commons in the next week. If a future photographer wanted to take clearer images of the inscriptions it might help to take water to wet them.SovalValtos (talk) 17:08, 21 August 2024 (UTC)

That's great! Thank you so much, looking forward to the pictures — Gor1995 𝄞 21:11, 21 August 2024 (UTC)

Gor1995 images now uploaded with lazy descriptions. I leave it to you or others as to what should be used in the article.

Heseltine-3

.SovalValtos (talk) 10:19, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

Awesome pictures! Thanks a lot, cheers — Gor1995 𝄞 11:28, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

Psychiatric Diagnosis

"Towards the end of his life, Heseltine became depressed by a loss of his creative inspiration". Depression is a complex subject requiring psychiatric expertise and accurate diagnosis. It's usually multifactorial and not simply reactive to a single event. It may be more accurate to simply state the evidence and circumstances without making an armchair diagnosis. ~2026-32368-7 (talk) 19:19, 15 January 2026 (UTC)

While there is a clinical diagnosis by that term, there is also an emotional state. Nikkimaria (talk) 05:51, 16 January 2026 (UTC)

Warlock's biographers David Cox, John Bishop and Barry Smith plus Grove, Jeremy Dibble in the Oxford Companion to Music, and the ODNB all refer to his depression. To dismiss all these with the disparaging term "armchair diagnosis" is unhelpful. Tim riley talk 08:35, 16 January 2026 (UTC)