Talk:Gore Court

location information

I'm going to tentatively suggest that there's something wrong with the location information given in this article. the Lat and Long co-ordinates given in the info box (51.405°N 0.018°E) point to a location adjacent to High Street, Bromley, around 30 miles from Sittingbourne. there might be a Gore Court there, but it won't be the one that this article discusses. according to Google maps, Gore Court Cricket and Hockey Club can be found in Sittingbourne itself, here: (51.34586, 0.70646). which I think is 51° 20' 45N, 0° 42' 22E. have fun. Cottonshirtτ 07:20, 8 June 2025 (UTC)

Thanks. You're right. Prob my error. Fixed. Blue Square Thing (talk) 07:26, 8 June 2025 (UTC)

earliest use for cricket

the history section says "The first recorded cricket match on the ground was in 1860," which doesn't seem to be correct. "On Wednesday last a cricket match took place in the park belonging to F. Bradley, Esq., between the two junior Sittingbourne clubs, which excited some interest in the vicinity." source: Kentish Gazette, Tue 14 Aug 1838 p. 4. the teams are not identified but one of them scored 62 and 57, while their opponents scored 25 and 11. F. Bradley Esq., will be Francis Bradley Dyne who owned Gore Court from 1823 until his death in 1851 when it was bought by George Smeed, owner of a brick works and cement works in Sittingbourne. Smeed permitted sports of all sorts to be played there, archery, football, foot races, as well as cricket. Smeed died in May 1881, and the estate was put up for auction and purchased by Richard Denne, a farmer, for £12,800. he leased the house as a boarding school. see: East Kent Gazette, Sat 10 Jun 1882 p. 5. Cottonshirtτ 15:13, 16 June 2025 (UTC)

Which ground is that on? GC used to play at what is now the Borden GS lower field – the ground was used by Kent Seconds as well, I think in the 20th century. Howard Milton suggests that the current ground - the lower one I imagine - was only created in 1929, so there may be errors that'll want looking in to. Bradley owned the Gore Court estate? That was apparently the school lower field and, presumably, an area of land around it. The house was pulled down in 1926 I believe. I don't know who owned the current ground on the A2 at that point - the EKG may be able to help out with when it was opened – as I say, Milton says 1929. I'll take a look at some old maps... Blue Square Thing (talk) 18:58, 16 June 2025 (UTC)

Yeah, the article's a mess. The source for the 1860 match has probably changed since it was used originally – that match took place on the Bell Road ground. The hockey club history helps a little as well. CricketArchive still has two matches pre-1929 on current ground (which it calls The Grove), but I suspect that they're in error.

I imagine the article needs a total refocusing on Gore Court as multiple entities – the estate, the original cricket ground on it, and the current cricket club and ground. Unless we split the current club off into an article by itself – but I'm not sure if that's a good idea or not. It'll sort of depend on what we can find on the history of the estate that's usable. There should be plenty, but I might struggle to access all of the available sources. Assuming that the library in the town is actually open these days, perhaps that might help? e2a: the Gore Court Championships article will need some adjusting as well Blue Square Thing (talk) 19:09, 16 June 2025 (UTC)

this might help Cottonshirtτ 02:03, 17 June 2025 (UTC)

Lovely job. I've used their stuff before and it's always good. I thought I might have read that before, but it seems to be a 2024 publication so obviously not – then the photo of the pavilion reminded me that it was probably the information boards that I'd have read when I was in the area a couple of years ago. I'll have a think about how best to structure this. I wonder if we might end up needing two articles? Gore Court estate and Gore Court Cricket and Hockey Club? Blue Square Thing (talk) 05:50, 17 June 2025 (UTC)

I don't think there's enough material for two articles, just be clear in your own mind when you are writing about the estate, and the club. the club are called Gore Court but did not always play there, and do not play there now. so one way to do it is to have the history of the estate, etymology, uses over time, up to the demolition of the house, and creation of the king George V playing field. then have a separate section for the cricket club and hockey club.

I found some maps. if you look at them in order you can see how the estate got carved up. this also makes it clear that the current Gore Court Club is not actually anywhere near Gore Court itself. it's 2 miles away the other side of the A2.

Gore Court Park (1865)

Gore Court Park (1896)

Gore Court Park (1906)

Gore Court Park (1938)

Gore Court Park (1947)

Gore Court Park estate: 51.32793, 0.72578; Gore Court cricket and hockey club: 51.34570, 0.70697. have fun. Cottonshirtτ 09:09, 17 June 2025 (UTC)

Yeah, thanks – found some other bits and pieces about the area around the current ground too.

I'm thinking that if there's too much/it's too confusing having it in one article that we could:

• move this article to Gore Court Cricket Club to deal with both the current ground and the ground on Bell Road, as well as mentioning that cricket was played at Gore Court as well;
• provide redirects for Gore Court Hockey Club, The Grove, Sittingbourne, and Gore Court Cricket Ground at least. There's half an argument for Grove Park, Kent or Grove Park, Sittingbourne as well (at least one OS map refers to the ground as The Grove Park), but I'll need to check the naming. The article would then need to mention the primary school as well;
• then work this article up as an article about the estate, cross referencing with the Cricket Club article;
• an alternative might be to move this to The Grove Cricket Ground, but I'm less convinced that we can deal with the complexity of the multiple grounds and uses with that

Any thoughts? It'll depend on whether it turns out to be too much/confusing perhaps Blue Square Thing (talk) 12:51, 17 June 2025 (UTC)

part of the problem is that this article is called Gore Court, but is actually about a cricket ground called The Grove, which just happens to be the home of a cricket club called Gore Court, who started off somewhere else. the first sentence of the article reads, "The Grove, Gore Court is a sports ground in Sittingbourne in Kent" except that The Grove is not even at the venue previously called Gore Court. my suggestion would be to re-name the article to Gore Court Cricket Club. then have a history section giving the early history of cricket at Gore Court, starting in 1838. Jan 1860 Sittingbourne Cricket Club and Gore Court Cricket Club amalagamate to make Sittingbourne and Gore Court Cricket club (sources: South Eastern Gazette, Tue 31 Jan 1860 p. 5; Kentish Chronicle, Sat 4 Feb 1860 p. 4). that summer, 16-17 Jul 1860, Gentlemen of Kent vs Gentlemen of Berks, cricket match at Gore Court Park. this is the start of what today would be called first class cricket at this venue. the match was scheduled for two days but rain on the first day restricted the match to one innings each on the second day. Gentlemen of Kent 133, Gentlemen of Berks 76 (source: East Kent Gazette, Sat 21 Jul 1860 p. 4) then proceed with further important matches, the sale of Gore Court, ground changes to a school, cricket club move elsewhere. today they play at the Grove. etc. Cottonshirtτ 04:03, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

tbf, a local would say "I'm playing at Gore Court" or "I'm going down Gore Court" rather than use "The Grove". It's somewhere I first played at in the late 1970s and I honestly don't think I even knew it was called The Grove until the last few months. I'll have a bit of a think about the rest of this and get back to it either later today or tomorrow. I'd not forgotten about it, but have been stupid busy Blue Square Thing (talk) 16:58, 21 July 2025 (UTC)