Talk:Chuhra

Ehm

This article could be expanded. As its stands, it makes very little sense...

It should be deleted as no citations. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.69.234.93 (talk) 18:58, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

No POV (points of View editing)please

Wikipedia requires neutrality to ensure high quality articles. There are numerous edits by random unregistered users who have not referenced or just randomly deleted or rewrite referenced statements. Churah is the designated folk term for this social group in the Punjab not all over India and The Indian Government register that the Majority of this population are followers of the Sikh Faith. Remember we are dealing with a Punjabi Population here not all over India. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Smith012 (talk • contribs) 16:59, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

plg remove all content related to word chura .as it csst entitlement intensely given to social deprived pepoles by some nerrowminded peoples. it is constitutionaly banned so you are humbly requested otheewise ,tere are indian justic also. Sham08gju (talk) 17:34, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Thats right delete it sooner the possible Sparodic (talk) 16:59, 19 June 2019 (UTC)

ISPCK

We have a source published by the ISPCK. Given that it is an evangelical organisation, we wouldn't usually use such a source except in situations where it was a comment about the organisation itself. Why should this one be treated differently? - Sitush (talk) 09:49, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Remove the chrsistian reference i was not aware it was evangelical, thank you for making me aware.Smith012 (talk)

I will leave it for now and try to find something better. My gut feeling is that what the source says is broadly correct; for example, while the Portuguese did a lot of conversions in the south, well before the Raj, I don't think they ever got as far as the Punjab. - Sitush (talk) 10:20, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Thankyou Sitush, your help would be greatly appreciated on this matter hopefully we can resolve this and produce a better quality article.Smith012 (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 10:25, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Census data

The Punjab census data is not verification of geographic spread of the Chuhra community, merely evidence that they are recorded in Punjab. There are plenty of sources out there that demonstrate the Chuhra exist in significant numbers elsewhere. Indeed, it would be surprising if they did not. - Sitush (talk) 10:12, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Ah yes, but the punjab cencus is recording on the basis of religious practices of the chura population within punjab, hence the 2001 census stands. Smith012 (talk)

No it doesn't. Have you ever read WP:OR and WP:PRIMARY? I see you have been around for a while but I've left you links to the policies and you do not seem to be understanding them. - Sitush (talk) 10:18, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

I would presume that the Indian government census is a credible source. According to the 2001 census to say that the majority of churas are hindus would be inaccurate as the government census records that over 2 million of them practice sikhism at 31.6% total population of scedule castes. It stats that only 11% follow hinduism in Punjab. There fore it is inaccurate to state they are a majority Hindu balmiki population Smith012 (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 10:22, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

You have to remember we are dealing with a punjabi social group whom are divided in indian and pakistani punjab and not socially equivalent bangis in other states who speak a completely different language to them Smith012 (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 10:24, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

I propose for now at least we go along with the Indian government census data of 2001, I would say that the government source on population would be the most accurate. I relation to christianity i will remove the evangelical sources as you have rightly pointed out. We can build on from that also i will keep the reference to them also being known as bhangi. Hopefully you can help me out and find some better sources to supplement the referencing. I propose this as a temporary edit for the moment. Many thanks Smith012 (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 10:31, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

No. You are engaging in original research and cherry-picking sources to that end. There are all sorts of other problems with your edits (eg: see WP:INDICSCRIPT and WP:LEAD) but they are trivial by comparison. The entire thing needs reverting back to its state of a few days ago and then rebuilding with due attention paid to our policies. - Sitush (talk) 05:09, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Moved the article title to "Balmiki"

The word Chuhra is a slur and is offensive for the member of the community, so change it to Balmiki as it is the official name of the caste.

Himankshu (talk) 15:31, 13 July 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 June 2025

2404:3100:18AC:5930:1:0:60C3:989F (talk) 09:26, 7 June 2025 (UTC)

I saw the sub castes of Chura! one thing is wrong in that the Sahotra is the sub castes of Jatt not the chura... You can check the family tree of Sahotra on JattLand.Com..... it is the website where all Jatt tribe history is avail... On the other hand there are several proofs that Then and Now the caste Sahotra occupy the agriculture land

 Not done: Jattland.com is a UGC source and is therefore unreliable. Please clearly explain the changes you are proposing and provide reliable sources to support them. – DreamRimmer ■ 12:17, 7 June 2025 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 8 August 2025

Requested Changes:

Remove Entirely: "Muslim Chuhras are still today barred from entrance to mosques and never allowed to go past the outside steps to Muslim religious places."

Change: "In the same way that Hindu Chuhras who were barred from entrance to temples in historical times, Muslim Chuhras are still today barred from entrance to mosques and never allowed to go past the outside steps to Muslim religious places. The Untouchability even extended after death; Chuhras were to bury their dead in separate graveyards away from other Muslims."

To: "While Islamic teachings strictly prohibit discrimination, some remote communities historically practiced social segregation, including separate burial grounds - a violation of Islamic principles. In urban Pakistan, such distinctions are based more on socioeconomic status than birth caste."

Add After Conversion Discussion: "Note: These practices contradict Quran 49:13 and Hadith that explicitly forbid discrimination. Modern Islamic scholars universally reject caste-based exclusion."

Change: "The Chuhras did not accept Mohammed as their prophet and also continued observing traditional Hindu festivals, such as Diwali, Rakhi and Holi."

To: "Some early converts maintained certain cultural practices during their transition to Islam, though Islamic doctrine requires rejecting rituals incompatible with monotheism."

Justification:

Removes false claim about mosque exclusion (Islam prohibits this)

Clarifies that burial segregation was limited/localized, not Islamic

Adds context about Pakistan's class vs. caste dynamics

Maintains historical accuracy while correcting theological misrepresentations

Provides proper Islamic context via Quran/Hadith references

Required Sources:

Quran 49:13 (for equality principle)

Sahih Muslim hadith on burial practices

Academic source on Pakistan's social stratification (e.g., "Islam and Social Stratification in Pakistan")

Editors should:

Remove the mosque exclusion claim entirely

Replace the burial paragraph with more nuanced version

Add the theological clarification note

Modify the conversion practices description

Ensure all changes are properly sourced KashifAhmad2003 (talk) 21:40, 8 August 2025 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit extended-protected}} template. — 🪫Volatile ^{📲T | ⌨️C} 02:00, 10 August 2025 (UTC)

Etymology of chuhra is wrong

Chuhra is not a corruption of Shudra but a prakrit form of word "च्युतहरा" which is "च्युत + हरा". It means "One who takes away that is fallen off (from body like excreta)". Source: Punjabi dictionary [pdf page no. 683]: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/%E0%A8%AE%E0%A8%B9%E0%A8%BE%E0%A8%A8_%E0%A8%95%E0%A9%8B%E0%A8%B8%E0%A8%BC_%E0%A8%AD%E0%A8%BE%E0%A8%97_2.pdf Ethicalweb (talk) 15:36, 13 August 2025 (UTC)